.

[kemal81]

Rikler, welcome to GTO but I think you give your opinions which almost all the rest of us disagree as if they are facts. Here's you what you think, followed by facts.
Axis can't win -> Axis wins as much as the Allies with bids of G7 or something close. Proof is the 1000's of games played here.
Gametable has a simplified version of the real game -> You are comparing original to revised. How can revised be more simplified when it has additional units and more detailed map than the original?
What I find amazing is that most of you fellers operate on the assumption that Gametable is a monopoly on Axis and Allies experience -> GTO doesn't have the monopoly that is true but if you have played 1000000 times original and 0 times revised than you have less experience than someone who played revised 100 times in a revised game.
I`m just saying that the Axis needs more help then it gets in this version of the game -> No they don't. The bids here are good enough help
Now I will admit that I am a mediocre Allied player because I played Axis almost all the time but inspite of that handicap I will be happy to give you axis with 10. (this was your response to me)-> You give me that bid and I will squash you like a bug. Oh yeah this one is a fact, too . Unless of course you are super lucky in the game. Just to be clear it has to be PBEM (2 or 3 day limit) and G10, no tech.
Again welcome to GTO, but give yourself more time and good luck with your future games.

[Rikler]

.

[Rikler]

.

[Zhukov4]

Rikler here's my armchair shrink analysis of what's going on in your head.

Essentially, you are a novice to Revised so you've been unable to win as Axis, even with a relatively high bid. And you don't have the experience to play as Allies and win up against a G9-G10 bid.

So you are trying to rationalize getting a G10 bid to play Axis and passing it off as fair. But the only way to prove G10 is fair is establish that Allies can consistently win up against that bid...so to prove it you'd need to become an Allied expert, not an Axis expert.

G10 isn't that far off if you are playing with tech or with low luck or both. But in the dice/nt format favored on here, 10 is a high bid. Experts tend to prefer playing Axis and can win with G7 or less.

You seem to rate the AAWC players alot, so you ought to go to their message board and ask them their views on a fair bid for Revised. Those of them that play Revised will tell you 8-9 (which is standard since like 2006-07...that's 5+ years...the only evidence the bid is moving is that bids of 5-7 are also popular among experts on here), and they'd probably refer you to GTO (the dominant Revised players in their rankings are GTO players--Freshprince is undefeated last I checked).

[aagamer_kc03]

the dominant Revised players in their rankings are GTO players--Freshprince is undefeated last I checked).

Mostly true My record here is far better than there lol

[Rikler]

.

[bb82]

Normally I'd just think it was a highly opinionated noob (nothing wrong with). But the constant attacks on the game and the advertisement of a completely different A&A community makes me think we are dealing with something entirely different.


An internet troll: a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into a desired emotional response.

[Sammog]

What? I want to get challenged with a G10 bid. That sounds hilarious fun! CHALLENGE ME PLEASE!!! 3-day timer. I'm far from expert though. I'm also definitely a troll.

edit: I'm confused. How do you challenge someone and choose nation you're challenging with?

[Rikler]

.

[Rikler]

.

[kemal81]

Hey Rikler,
First of all please type in my user name correctly, OK, seriously. Secondly I don't play at any other website other than here.
"Your opinion that someone who has played 100 gto games is more experienced then someone who played the old game at a high level is wishful thinking."
That's only your opinion. If you played Revised 0 times, then you have very little experience, even if you have played original so many times. The very thread you posted here pretty much proves it. 2 games are very different. The players who are expert in revised here had the same experience when they played 1942 the first time. Many said Allies can't win in this version. But then we came to realize that we just have to give more time to know the game more. So just freaking give yourself more time with Revised.
About tech I really don't like having it, neither the most people here. I think with tech the luck factors in more than strategy. But that's my opinion and so many people here. I mean come on using tech in original, allies can simply roll tech from the start and if they get early they win the game, if not Axis win the game. I would rather flip a coin rather wasting all that time.

[aagamer_kc03]

I know I'll get ripped....but here goes

I appreciate those that don't want advertising of other sites. I have no problem with that. However, Rikler is just acknowledging it's existence and giving his opinion of the quality of players. Warclub has been dead anyway since 2003-2004 and the MSN Gaming zone soon after. As far as AAWC, who really cares, they exist, we exist and if there was a cd rom version of the game (Revised) they would still exist and so would we. At no point are any of his posts trying to draw members to them and I find some rather sensitive people responding based on their own assumptions.

The AAWC guys that have migrated here are very strong players. The 20 or so I know of all have good winning records and if they have any advantage its that they have played 1000's of hours online before GTO came out. Over my time here, I have learned to bite my tongue and reference AAWC only when illustrating a point....which is what Rikler is doing here.

As far as which players are better, etc...again he is entitled to is opinion and it's not the main point he is trying to make. And who really cares? It's like sometimes people take the silliest things so seriously.

I am in a game with him, he has been a gentleman, made no assumptions and has played a VERY strong game. I had a great G1 and he had a mediocre R1/B1. J1 and G2 not as well lol...but he has played the same style I have seen from many top players.

If you really think about the g10 bid vs a g8 bid...in some ways it makes sense. Not having that armor to attack or defend in egy is a big deal (BB- That's in part why you go at g4 I would guess) If your not a UKR hitter than that extra german inf is of little consequence in Ukr and again having 1 less armor in egy can be a problem for the axis depending on how their first turn goes.

Maybe his posts are a little opinionated, again this is an online game where people (SELF INCLUDED!) sometimes read into a post what they "think" the intent/meaning/subliminal message is.

I will say this. When MSN Gaming zone was at its heyday they had 3 clubs. BOP (Balance of Power), Spring '42, and Warclub. Without much arguement Warclub was the strongest and the best players played there.

GTO should welcome members that migrate from another site and though advertising it may not be cool....to get so mad when someone acknowledges it's existence and experiences they had there is simply childish and defensive. I mean really? Someone mentions the word AAWC and everyone gets up in arms.

I challenge anyone to show where, in any post, Rikler was promoting another site to go play on.

Rikler- I am enjoying our game very much and our (little) chat as well!

[squatch]

Well said aagamer :]

[bb82]

I find some rather sensitive people responding based on their own assumptions.

The same can be said the other way too.

(BB- That's in part why you go at g4 I would guess) If your not a UKR hitter than that extra german inf is of little consequence in Ukr

I play axis competitively as g3-g4, never higher than g6. Even if I win a bid higher I set game up with me as g6. I might not hit ukr that often, but since most do, another inf there would certainly help my axis. The reason I think less than g6 is needed is because there is no way to make the game perfectly even at the start. Therefore one side will have an advantage. I think the allies should have the advantage since they have to coordinate so well together, with no single allied power having too much potential to be deadly on its own. The reverse is not true of the axis.

But when players are more aggressive the bid matters less and the opening dice much more.

Maybe his posts are a little opinionated, again this is an online game where people (SELF INCLUDED!) sometimes read into a post what they "think" the intent/meaning/subliminal message is.

There is nothing wrong with constructive opinion. But wording is everything. It can be easy for 'opinion' to quickly become something else entirely.

GTO should welcome members that migrate from another site and though advertising it may not be cool....to get so mad when someone acknowledges it's existence and experiences they had there is simply childish and defensive. I mean really? Someone mentions the word AAWC and everyone gets up in arms.

GTO welcomes everyone and there is nothing wrong about chatting about another site. But to make highly subjective assertions rather than a less argumentative opinion (i.e. Axis can't win, AAWC are better players, Gametable has a simplified version of the real game, strategy is easier and more basic, I don`t think the best players would do this form of the game, etc) will tend to provoke some sort of negative response.

Wording is always the key. Granted, even if you take the time to try to properly word your intent, it can/will be skewed by others. Too many variables are at hand. Minimizing emotion when opinions are given certainly helps though.

[rem400]

Rikler:

There are many ways to introduce yourself to a new group of gamers. As you will find, GTO is a group of very passionate gamers whether it's A&A or any other game. I would have suggested another approach but that ship sailed.... Welcome.